Theres no real plot or arc to the narrative.
Instead, the film offers up the horrifying reality of the familys life for the audience to inspect.
Camerimage runs until Nov 18.
Łukasz ŻalRobin L Marshall/Getty Images.
DEADLINE:ukasz, I know Jonathan had been working on this film for many years.
How did you get involved?
UKASZ ZAL:Jon came to me with the idea of shooting with ten cameras.
So we were shooting everything in one or two hours, and there were no resets.
The weather is changing in the shot.
The idea was not to judge, fetishize, or glamorize.
We didnt want to manipulate the audiences decisions with framing or camera position.
We wanted to make a film where you couldnt feel an author behind the camera.
DEADLINE:You didnt use lights at all?
Only once to simulate the flame of the crematorium on the face.
DEADLINE:What youre describing to me really resembles reality TV.
ZAL:That was the thing that Jon told me.
Were making Big Brother in the Nazi House.
DEADLINE:So where were you and the crew when the cameras were rolling?
ZAL:We were in a container like a mission control container.
It was me, Jon, our first AD, the sound team, and the costume designer.
That was our key decision-making crew.
We were all hidden.
And then actors could come on set and just live there for a few hours cooking and cleaning.
DEADLINE:There is one part of the film that isnt Objective.
The black-and-white dream sequences…
ZAL:Yes, those are thermal images.
It was also Jons idea.
So how can you shoot at night with no light, and we are not using any light?
Thats why we used the thermal camera.
We wanted to be as close to reality as possible.
We also used artificial intelligence to upscale those images because the camera was very low resolution.
They were old military cameras.
Also, the young girl in those scenes represents the light and hope in all the darkness.
ZAL:Thats mostly Jons responsibility because he is making final decisions.
I can adjust framing or camera position.
I have great respect for him.
He was so uncompromising.
He called me and said we need to do something new.
We need a completely different approach.
Hes a very bold guy.
And that was every day for us.
But over time, you find the solution.
It was an amazing process.
DEADLINE:Was it a long shoot?
ZAL:Yeah, it was 50-something days.
DEADLINE:This is your first film since you shot Charlie Kaufmans Im Thinking of Ending Things.
Im sure youve been sent many scripts since the Oscar nomination.
ZAL:There are a lot of scripts, but not so many for me.
I need to be connected to a project.
I cannot makeSpiderman.
I wouldnt even be able to make black and white Spiderman.
Im very picky, but sometimes, I would love not to be like this.
The film must always in some way resonate with me.
