EXCLUSIVE: I sit down for breakfast withCharlie Sheennot exactly knowing what to expect.
It has been a dozen years since then, and I come in harboring my own feelings.
DEADLINE:It was an easy yes when Chuck Lorre asked you to return?
Omar J. Dorsey, Chuck Lorre and Charlie Sheen on the set of ‘Bookie’John Johnson/Max
CHARLIE SHEEN: Yeah.
I mean, save for asking Chuck to not have me actually in rehab, as a patient.
I felt like that would be looking back and he totally agreed.
‘Two And a Half Men’Warner Bros. 2023
And then he came up with, well, lets create a mislead.
And it happened almost 20 years to the day we shot that.
DEADLINE:Ive watched your seven seasons on that show I could recite the jokes.
It felt like you guys could have just gone on for 10 years if you wanted to.
So they say, dont live in regret, but you have to honor it.
You have to learn from it.
Or is that eclipsed by, how could I have f*cked this…
SHEEN: Up?
Yeah, there are a lot of great memories.
And we didnt phone it in.
We knew what we had, and the value of taking the time to create it properly.
And I knew the rules, from day one.
And so when I started butting up against those, the rules never changed.
I would look at it from an athletic point of view.
And then, somewhere along the way, I decided that the rules no longer applied to me.
And that was not fair to the system that was in place.
And anytime external elements contaminate the main thing, I would look for someone to blame.
And thats not fair.
Its not fair to Chuck.
Its not fair to the show.
I went through two divorces, had four kids during that show.
There was a lot of sh*t in my personal life that was a little bit distracting.
But you got to leave that stuff at the doorstep of the stage door, right?
Thats hard, but you got to park it.
And I was on the phone with my manager and I think one of the agents.
And I said, I dont know, man.
I feel like we mightve reached our limit here.
And Im hearing no, no, no, man, theres so many more stories to tell.
Translation: money to be made for them.
Its a lot of money.
And I said, I dont know guys.
My gut is screaming that if I go back, its going to go horribly wrong.
I actually said that, and they were like, well, I can also go perfectly fabulous.
Im like, yeah, but thats not the message Im getting from my gut.
So did I manifest that or did I just get a signal from the future?
Maybe it was time.
So, do you bow out?
We cut the new deal and everybody was happy and then everything went horribly.
Fox when he left for health reasons.
SHEEN: Its what I grew up watching.
Its what I grew up really invested in as a form of entertainment.
That was very comforting for me.
That connected to the themes on the shows I was watching.
It was just part of my childhood.
When I finally got the opportunity to do it, it was terrifying.
I had done one episode ofFriends, and that was a really long week for me.
I remember finishing that and the people were great, from the showrunners to the cast and the audience.
It was a great night.
But I left there thinking, okay, I checked that box.
DEADLINE:Harder than drama?
SHEEN: Id never done theater.
I had no sense of interacting with an audience or letting them be part of it.
It tookSpin Cityfor me to figure it out.
DEADLINE:Charlie Harper was some dysfunctional anchor…
SHEEN: I was an anchor that was adrift.
But I had the benefit of, geez, the greatest co-star, a guy could ever ask for.
I say co-star, but I mean teammate.
You know what Im saying?
Playing with Jon, playing off of the things he was doing, it was magical.
When they said they were auditioning him, I was like, but hes got a resume for decades.
And they said, well, we need to see you guys together.
Im like, just watchHot Shots.
It was a moment that people speak of.
Youre like, really?
Chuck felt, I know Jon felt it.
DEADLINE:Was it a particular scene?
Its the scene that really defined who these guys are, early on.
DEADLINE:What made it exceptional?
I didnt say, Hey Jon, can I get a longer beat here?
We just read it and it was perfect.
He said, well have it over in a week.
And then as I was leaving, I stopped and asked, is there a title?
He said, were thinking of calling itTwo and a Half Men.
And I said, wow, that sounds like a hit.
So theres those magical moments in the early part of the journey.
Its been cathartic for me.
What are you going to do?
Beat yourself up for your entire life?
No, no, I cant do that.
I cant do that.
Youre not going to go forward.
I wish I could answer really what people ask.
I dont truly know.
You and me both.
I felt something similar when he died about, wow, you could easily be reading about me instead.
That was really sad when that happened.
I just read his book.
About six weeks ago, and I read it in a day.
Yeah, I turned off my phone.
I just stayed in it and it wasnt like I finished at 2 in the morning.
I finished at 8:15.
DEADLINE:What made you not be able to put it down?
SHEEN: Because I can relate to it so much of it.
Because I was reliving or I was experiencing it with him.
A lot of the struggle, a lot of the obsession.
He was smart and funny, and yeah, he was charming and it wasnt always about him.
He was a special cat.
I wish I knew him better.
He mentioned being part of your crowd.
Was he in your short film group?
SHEEN:I havent seenOppenheimeryet, but I heard he just nailed it.
We were in the same high school.
But no, he wasnt part of the home movie group that we established.
That was Sean and Chris Penn, Rob and Chad Lowe, Emilio and myself.
I dont know if he grew up in Malibu or what.
DEADLINE:You all had parents in the business.
Were you thinking this is where you would go?
SHEEN: Nah, we made Super 8 films, and Sean was the first to graduate.
DEADLINE:Were you all thinking, were the next generation?
SHEEN:No, no, we were just having fun.
We were just trying to emulate or impersonate a lot of the stuff we were watching our parents do.
No, we had stories we wanted to tell.
We kind of wrote them on the fly.
If something worked, then wed build on that.
If it sucked, wed start over.
It just progressed like any hobby does when youve got…
Is that Arnold?
Is that Arnold that just passed?
[Indeed, Arnold Schwarzenegger passes by outside the restaurant window.]
SHEEN: Thats pretty cool.
I saw him in the mirror.
DEADLINE:He looks like he could kick both our asses…
SHEEN: Him?
But Im going to go low.
DEADLINE:How about you go low, and Ill run that way toward the exit.
But yeah, a lot of the kids were surfing and we were making movies.
It was pretty cool.
DEADLINE:Its funny when you say, yeah, we were just doing this.
SHEEN: He is really nice; really nice.
Tom was great, man.
DEADLINE:It happened fast for him.
Was there something you saw in him that early?
He had that thing.
Women want to be with him, and guys want to be like him.
He had that and there was an innocence that he had.
So I think when the massive talent emerged, I think it caught people off guard.
I think they were suddenly really pleasantly surprised at how complex the talent is within him.
Hes got three of them and theyre glaring:Jerry McGuire,Born on the Fourth of JulyandMagnolia.
Those are great performance.
Oh, Im sorry.
Theres probably a fifth one Im forgetting.
I mean, who wants to be in therapy at 15?
And I remember having one session with this guy.
I wasnt even acting yet, maybe I was 16, thinking about it.
And he said, unless you celebrate other peoples successes, you will never have any of your own.
I was like, oh, okay.
Thats the only thing I remember from the 51 minutes we spent together.
So I was rooting for everyone.
I always felt, theres enough jobs to go around for everybody back when meritocracy was something that mattered.
SHEEN: No, I was in high school when Emilio invited me to the screening ofThe Breakfast Club.
And so she read theFerris Buellerscript.
The only exposure I had of theBuellerscript was sides that C Thomas Howell was rehearsing his audition.
It was the shower scene, the monologue.
DEADLINE:What role was Howell up for?
SHEEN: Ferris Bueller, before Matthew Broderick got it.
I had never auditioned for John Hughes.
He was a smoker, so I put some cigarette ash under my eyes.
I knew the scene.
I drove all the way down there, and I see John Hughes walking across the parking lot.
Hes leaving his trailer.
He is heading to set.
He was right around dusk, and hes starting to walk past me.
I hear Mr. Hughes, Ive got Charlie Sheen.
Im expecting him to then say, Oh, great, youre here.
Okay, lets go read the scene.
Instead, he doesnt break stride.
Hes like, Oh, hey, okay, you look great, kid.
Ill see you in a couple weeks.
And he kept going.
And I was like, okay, I guess that means I got the job.
That was my audition.
The morning we shot, I overslept.
I was up super late, not even partying, just Im wanting to look tired for this role.
These days, that requires no effort.
I got single-dad eyes, and thats a whole other chapter.
So I was up to late at the time for me, it was 1 a.m.
I woke in a panic, jumped in the car, sped down there.
Jennifer Grey is in front of her trailer, staring at her watch.
Shes like, How could you fucking do this to me?
I went out of my way.
I put my neck on the line for you.
How could you do this to me?
I go, hey, hey, hey, everybody.
And so I go through makeup.
He says, Oh, good.
He wasnt like, you amateur, you slacker, how dare you?
Dont you know who I am?
No, it was, youre here.
Interesting way to live life, isnt it?
DEADLINE:Got a similar story on yourPlatoondirector Oliver Stone.
Im 20 minutes in.
I guess he sees the color drain from my face.
The tape recorder isnt taping.
He says, whats the matter?
Without a beat, he says, can you get it to work?
And he said, lets start again.
But I have never forgotten how gracious he was to a young reporter ready to melt through the floor.
Sounds like Hughes showed you the same kind of grace.
SHEEN: That was around 39 years ago, and thats the story Im telling all these decades later.
As opposed to a story Im not excited to share.
And that role, it was life-changing.
One day youre auditioning, the next day youre not.
It was just…cool.
It shifts your focus.
It doesnt really change anything in what your goals are, what your process is, how you prepare.
But yeah, it makes it a lot more fun.
Cant lie about that.
To be doing something where you feel suddenly appreciated, recognized, where you feel like people value you.
Its a pretty good thing.
Theres BP and AP, beforePlatoonand afterPlatoon.
Everything changed, like overnight.
DEADLINE:In the jungle, stuff blowing up all around you.
What was the hardest thing about making that movie?
SHEEN: Just the endurance.
It wasnt like the scenes were so long to memorize.
Whatever that is written, its what the moment needs or whats required.
DEADLINE:What was your relationship with Oliver?
DEADLINE:How did Oliver Stone help pull this coming of age stuff out of you?
Clearly he knew what he wanted…
SHEEN: We had to somehow develop a shorthand.
We had done a full cast read-through while we were still in training camp.
I wanted to yo him first and me second, whatever thats worth.
Hed ruin the take.
But I saw him having a joyous physical responses, he was so excited.
He was rooting for his favorite team, down by five with a minute left inside the five.
When you give a speech?
Its kind of the same thing with acting.
Youre never quite sure of the three.
Its like a shell game.
Which one you should have gone with?
I just wish that that had at had spilled over intoWall Street,the camaraderie and the connection.
We were almost spiritually connected onPlatoon.
DEADLINE:How was it different onWall Street?
SHEEN: A lot different.
That was a really difficult shoot, harder thanPlatoonin some ways.
There was energy deep in the details.
And at one point Michael kind of leans in.
Id known him for a week now.
Hes like, can you think of anything different that we should do with this?
He was basically saying, Im out of ideas.
Im at the end of my rope.
And I was like, I got nothing, boss.
He was like, yeah, me neither.
We bonded through the struggle.
In Olivers defense, we were up against the directors strike toward the end of the movie.
So we had to shoot 16 days, in eight.
This wasnt second-unit pickups, We had to do twice the work in half the time.
DEADLINE:Michael Douglas is another guy who comes from a storied acting family.
What kind of kinship forms from that?
SHEEN: You just brought something I never thought to engage him on because the workload was so intense.
I never wanted to be that guy.
I felt like I was in a dinghy in the Indian Ocean.
So we never really even got into that stuff.
I think its okay to honor that, to recognize it.
Its like, you meet Roy Scheider.
DEADLINE:Sounds like a story there…
SHEEN: Its funny.
I do have a regret about Scheider.
I was 12 years old.Jawshad been in the theater for almost a year at that point.
We had been in the Philippines.
Dad drops me at a diner in Malibu that no longer exists.
He says, I got to run to the post office.
Ill be right back.
At that point, Ive seenJawsprobably 50, 60 times, no joke.
In a movie theater.
It was an obsession.
Anyway, its madness.
Its Chief Brody, its Roy Scheider.
You guys probably have met in New York.
Hes across the street.
I just wanted to say hello.
I didnt say a fricking word.
And then I guess he was just having coffee, and he left, and dad came back.
DEADLINE:Sounds like this haunted you.
SHEEN: I lived with this for years and years and years.
So we doTwo And a Half Men.
So at least the circle was closed, by mom.
At least he knew.
And he was tickled by it, thought it was the coolest thing.
But damn, its like theres another thing we talk about regrets.
I had all those years to reach out to someone and never did.
DEADLINE:I watch that movie obsessively.
I could listen to Robert Shaws soliloquy about the USS Indianapolis right now and be shaken.
What stands up for you?
SHEEN: All that, and, well, there were no computers.
Everything they did had to be done practically.
And that blows my mind.
Much likeApocalypse, there were no computers.
These days you’re free to do anything.
Most times, the actors leave the set, go on vacation and on to the next project.
I dunno,Jawstouched something in all of us.
It touched the vulnerability.
Yesterday, I was Quint.
Today, Im Hooper.Star Warshad a similar effect.
Talk about raising the bar.
DEADLINE:I interviewed Ridley Scott forThe Martian, when JJ Abrams was revivingStar Wars.
He exited and told the guy he couldnt do his movie, he had to do something in space.
That led him toAlien.
So these films that change things forever have this ear-woven, connective DNA.
Also, it was Brian De Palma that told Lucas to put that scroll in the beginning.
He screened it and he was like, okay, its great.
But we dont know who anybody is.
We dont know where we are.
We dont know why we are there.
We love it, but its super confusing.
He said, why dont you just tell everybody, just write it out.
Just say, all right, heres whats going on.
And then start the movie.
DEADLINE:Speaking of mythology, youre back with Chuck Lorre, at least in two episodes ofThe Bookie.
Its fun seeing you back.
How did you like seeing yourself back?
SHEEN:It was all a surprise.
I have a fun story about that in one second.
So Im just an audience member from two through seven, actually two through eight.
Im along for the ride.
DEADLINE:Do you want to star in another sitcom?
Would that be too much, considering how it unraveled last time?
SHEEN:So youre asking would I do another sitcom?
SHEEN: Yes, I would.
And it wouldnt be too much on me.
It would be insanely satisfying and enjoyable.
I think people would really, really get a kick out of it.
DEADLINE:Would you want do it with Chuck Lorre?
SHEEN: Yes, absolutely.
Ill read the script when it gets there, but its as simple as that.
Because it goes back to give the people what they want.
So Im just basing it on what the vibe is out in the world.
And everybody wants to talk aboutTwo And a Half Men, but alsoMajor Leagueand theHot ShotsandMen at WorkandYoung Guns.
Is there more to your ambition?
SHEEN: Yeah, I owe it to myself, first and foremost.
But just on my observations, I have it on pretty good authority that they would enjoy it.
And thats what part of doingBookiewas all about.
It was an audition for accountability, responsibility, professionalism.
I was always the guy who was first to arrive and last to leave.
I went in overprepared…
DEADLINE:You want to be that guy again?
I want to be that guy again.
And so coming back to doBookie, I checked all those boxes.
It was really refreshing to reactivate those muscle groups.
And again, it was, right back where we were.
The shorthand between Chuck and I.
We were right back to having a shorthand that was there once.
He doesnt give a lot of notes.
He lets a performer do what hes doing because that is the reason he got the job.
He honors that and hell come in with one very specific thing.
And, hes always right.
Its kind of annoying.
And you do that thing, youre like, of course.
Okay, well that makes sense, how did I miss that?
But you cant think of everything all the time, right?
I think he was experiencing the same thing.
I was just us feeling the energy again of how it was, before it wasnt.
So that was exciting.
But I did something, I think I need to talk about it because nobody else does these days.
So leave it to this guy.
DEADLINE:Have at it.
So when youre watching it, you had just as much time to stay nervous.
I thought I did pretty good.
I thought the scene was really good.
I thought the show was terrific.
All the other actors were spot on, and I think it was so big.
SHEEN: Im focused, laser-focused … on a physical trait of mine.
And Im like, I need to fix that.
It was my neck.
DEADLINE:Your neck?
Its a saggy, flappy thing.
Im looking at that going, holy fcking sht. It looks like that.
This is Monday night.
DEADLINE:What did you do?
SHEEN: I could have stayed upset about it or I could get right into solution.
DEADLINE:Youre having it fixed?
SHEEN: It was either that or go shopping for turtlenecks.
Im doing it in two weeks.
But the next morning I was like, I didnt want to see that again.
And people shouldnt have to look at that.
Its the disadvantage of not being on camera for 10 years.
I see myself in the mirror every day and Im like, alright, things have held together.
This is the dialogue we have with ourselves in the morning.
Yeah, thisll have to do.
But I saw that and I was like, wow, the last decade, not so friendly.
DEADLINE:Can it be vanity if you are trying to remove something that might distract viewers?
SHEEN: And Im not implanting anything.
I am smoothing some sh*t out.
It really bothered me.
DEADLINE:Something that really bothers me.
This something you are big into?
I never bet and Im not sure theres a question here, but it seems this cant end well.
I dont bet, but I lived in that world.
I was 2, 5, 7.
I retired in 2009.
When [Manny] Pacquiao beat [Oscar] De La Hoya, I went out on a win.
DEADLINE:Why did you stop?
But the players, if theyre caught doing it, are penalized severely.
Its the greatest external revenue source for the NFL, maybe ever, outside of TV rights.
But no, no, no, no, the players mustnt bet.
We support it to a point, to theres a line.
I just find that to be a little hypocritical.
And what is this going to look like in five years?
SHEEN: First episode.
I think theres more of them than me.
DEADLINE:Did you get too far in?
I approached gambling like I approached drugs.
It was the same thing.
It was the same energy.
It was the same vibe.
Calling the bookie was like calling a dealer, waiting on the game was like waiting for the delivery.
And it was never about the result.
I finally decoded it one day.
It was that moment.
And once any of those four things, five things happen, youre in.
Theres no chicken exit.
Its like, okay, its on.
And thats the feeling I got addicted to, everything that led up to it.
DEADLINE:Did it noticeably cut into your earnings?
SHEEN: Yeah, at one point it did.
DEADLINE:The avoidance of bookies is the source of some of the funniest scenes inBookie.
Ever had to avoid one of these guys when you lost big?
SHEEN: I had to borrow, once, and that crossed the line for me.
The rule I always abided by was never make a bet you cant pay if you lose.
DEADLINE:How big a bet?
SHEEN: It was a lot.
It was a lot.
It was a couple weeks salary, but this was before the big deal.
It was enough to really have to scramble.
DEADLINE:Can you say which team let you down?
It was that one point in the season when a few sports cross over, I think its October.
No, Im sure of it.
And I lost 21 plays in a row.
You know what the odds of doing that are?
DEADLINE:You mean you lost 21 bets in a row?
SHEEN: Individual bets, Yeah.
Its like youre flipping a coin.
At some point its going to come out 50/50, right?
And it didnt, man.
Theyre like, this guys on a run you cant believe so heres what hes on.
You take the other side, and I guarantee youre going to win.
I can laugh about it now.
It wasnt funny then though.
No, I was talking to myself.
People couldnt believe it.
I had friends saying, Hey, why dont you take a day off?
And Chuck was like, what about Sheen?
He knows a lot about this world.
I witnessed it firsthand.
There was a producer onTwo And a Half Men, and we were gambling partners.
Wed go through the games all week and then wed land on a few.
And so, on show night, Id do a scene.
I couldnt track the scores.
For a while, I missed that guy too.
