The LA-based financier-producer is now in talks with the studio to potentially invest in double that number of movies.
The company was set up by Jason Cloth and Dave Caplan.
FORMATION & STRATEGY
DEADLINE:How did C2 come about?
‘Mission: Impossible Dead Reckoning - Part One,’ ‘The End We Start From,’ Jason Cloth & Dave Caplan.Everett/Courtesy
DAVE CAPLAN:Jason and I became friends socially.
We were having those conversations 18 month to two years ago.
DEADLINE:How is the company capitalized?
Mila Kunis and Michael KeatonCourtesy/Getty
JASON CLOTH:C2 is the next iteration of Creative Wealth.
So, we have the same institutions, the same philosophy of going after high-net-worth family offices.
Its designed to raise capital on a more sophisticated institutional level.
DEADLINE:Like Creative Wealth, a key resource is the Canadian pension funds as well?
DEADLINE: Which fields are the family offices in?
CLOTH:Different fields.
Theyre usually very entrepreneurial.
Wed rather have fewer better partners than money from any source.
Whats the status of your collaboration with them?
CLOTH:Bron doesnt factor into C2 at all.
C2 doesnt finance shows produced, sourced or originated by Bron.
Creative Wealth hasnt financed anything from Bron in the last year and a half.
Bron has gone on to do other things.
So, thats where we are.
DEADLINE:Are you still a director at Bron?
There are some similarities.
Is it about being more streamlined?
CLOTH:Its definitely more streamlined.
Dave and I are very cognisant of costs.
Were very cognisant of budgets, very picky as to the types of projects we do.
I would be foolish not to take a look at what got them to where they are.
DEADLINE:Financier Hudson Private sued Bron and Creative Wealth for failure to repay an investment.
What is the status of that legal case?
CLOTH:That was a little complicated.
It wasnt quite what was reported.
So, thats where that is.
It didnt quite go for them the way they thought it was going to go.
DEADLINE:And its ongoing?
CLOTH:Its only ongoing because of Brons situation.
But thats about as much as I can say.
That said, we have been discussing TV…
CAPLAN:Were definitely interested in TV.
Were exploring a few different projects and were definitely interested in unscripted.
So, yes, we are interested in TV but we havent found the right project to greenlight yet.
But there are conversations going on.
Come January, well be leaning into TV in a bigger way.
In terms of our film output, were being focused.
The team and script were so good that we couldnt say no.
Our producing partner on that, Daniela Taplin Lundberg, is a brilliant producer.
CLOTH:Were not very interested in co-financing and having a passive role…
DEADLINE:What credits do you normally take on projects?
CLOTH:Im usually executive producer while Davis is producer, along with a company credit.
DEADLINE:What budget do you have at your disposal each year?
DEADLINE:You havent financed a big Guy Richie movie yet, right?
Dave:We have not.
Wed love to do more with him.
Dave and I read a lot.
Dave reads a tremendous amount.
But theres a limit.
Were looking at ten, maybe ten-plus indie movies a year, in addition to our studio slate business.
We would go out and raise a separate capital pool for our TV business.
CAPLAN:Most of our projects are under $25M.
The sweet spot for us is probably $8-15M.
Ive not seen anything like it in the years that Ive been doing slate financing with major studios.
CLOTH:I dont think it was transformational.
Its certainly something that everybody still wants to talk about.
Being part of of quite a few studio films was more transformational than anything else.
We werent really treated much like partners before Paramount.
It wasnt a very fair game to play.
That was last years Cannes Film Festival.
Its a little like playing Blackjack.
Even if you play exactly like the house, the house still has a small advantage.
We probably have the best terms of any major studio slate financier.
CAPLAN:The executives at Paramount are also very, very good.
CLOTH:There arent many studios you’ve got the option to do a deal like this with.
MGM no longer exists in that way.
DEADLINE:Youre not going to disclose precise deal points but what are the parameters of these deals?
Thats what all the different terms do.
Its about minimizing the layers between you and the studio to make it more fair.
DEADLINE:What is your investment in these movies?
Weve identified seven or eight movies were negotiating terms on now.
DEADLINE:Thats a lot.Was Mission your biggest outlay?
Paramount didnt need to co-fi those movie with us but it was about beginning a collaboration.
DEADLINE:And some you should probably take a hit on…
CLOTH:Yes.
CLOTH:Well, thats just representative of the film business.
Looking back on it, and Im just going to speak for myself, I loved the movie.
I love the filmmaker.
They treated us with respect and grace.
DEADLINE:What is your assessment of the box office return so far for Mission?
The averageMissionmovie does 4.7 times its opening weekend.
They tend not to be front-loaded.
Its more of a slow burn.
I predict there will be some solid holds all the way into September.
It was built to do that.
DEADLINE:Very expensive, yes.
Do your core investors get spooked by those box office numbers?
CLOTH:The studios certainly can lose.
But box office isnt the only barometer for success these days.
Transactional business is way, way up, but thats not reported on as much.
CLOTH:Babylonwas not commercially successful.
But theres more to these deals.
We gain a level of copyright ownership.
A lot of the numbers youre referring to arent readily available or disclosed by studios or financiers.
The market has changed a bit.
People are now more comfortable renting at home.
Were just thankful to have been a part of these incredible movies.
Our clients know whether or not theyre part of these films.
On the other films coming out in future, our involvement will be front and center.
We are involved much earlier on those.
Some of these have releases well into 2024 and 2025.
I suppose like many, youre in a holding pattern with regards to an interim agreement?
Theres a level of complexity in getting them but our indie movies are true indies.
We think our director Mahalio Belo will be there but were not sure yet about cast.
Its far from ideal.
Theres an electric buzz you get from proper festival launches.
You dont get that if the talent isnt attending.
DEADLINE:How long do you think these strikes last?
CLOTH:I dont know.
Barry Diller previously predicted that if it goes into late September theres Armageddon coming for the industry.
I think itll probably go until late October, early November.
Were in business with both sides of this, the studios and the indies.
Were supportive of everyone getting a fair deal.
DEADLINE:A broad one to end.
Whats your take on the health of the film and TV markets right now?
Even Oscar-nominated dramas often dont resonate widely today.
The first question we ask is, will people want to watch this?
Youd be surprised how many people dont ask that question.
DEADLINE:Wasnt the Cannes market indicative of challenges in the indie finance space that you guys specialize in?
We announced more projects, pre-sale packages, than Ive ever announced before.
Good ones with strong cast and fundamentals.
But it was very quiet when it came to announcing sizeable deals.
CLOTH:Well, except that we had two movies and both did well.
We did very well onThe Monkey, for example.
CAPLAN:The market has been in contraction since what some call the Netflix correction.
It feels like fewer series are being announced, and probably fewer films are being seen in the cinemas.
I think people are still showing up for horror in a big way.
Action movies, too, with that 17-day theatrical window, that can be a good space.
And then with transactionals, I think what they did with movies likePlaneandViolent Nightwas smart.
Often that relates to theatrical.
CAPLAN: Marketing is so key right now.
In the film business, success is so difficult to achieve.
Its such an easy concept to explain to people, but its so infinitely difficult to achieve.
